Health Insurance Bill

tedeeoo · Post by **tedeeoo** » Thu Mar 25, 2010 12:32 am

Matt,

To be honest I can't really say how Europeans think on things, for me to try and do that (and not saying you were) would not be very smart. I agree with what you said, one way will not be the only way. As far as the U.S. adopting a more European way and that either making us or breaking us, there again I can't really say what a more European way is but I don't think we are "doomed" if we don't. And to be fair Matt, maybe I took that statement the wrong way.

Ian,

Most people that I have talked to do not think this plan will develop the way you see it, better yet most people I have talked to and/or listened to in this country don't want it to go that way. Now, someone outside of the U.S. may read that as "they don't care about their fellow man", but that is not the case. I think most people here very much would like something that covered people who don't have a way or means to do it theirself, but the reason people don't like this plan is that they see it as the government trying to control their lives, plus it in no way meets the President's stated goals on this policy. "By the people, for the people" only works when a democratic government votes for what their people actually want, not votes for their or their parties agenda. If being elected is their mandate to say "well I'm elected that means the people's vision is my vision (which is the reverse of what it should be)', then being voted out of office will be our rebuke of their failed comprehension of how our government (specifically representation) is supposed to work. Having said all that, I do not profess to have answers to all of our issues, I count myself as neither democrat or republican or any other party. I am an American, I think that a great many of our issues are much simpler than they are made out to be, I think we as a nation and especially our politicians have "lost heart" so to speak on the things that made us great. I think our best way back is simple, read the constitution, take it to heart in its most literal terms, that is read just what's on the paper not what you need it to say to fit your view. Our founding fathers had it right, they knew we'd make mistakes, they knew we'd need to amend and adjust for the times, I don't think they ever envisioned that we would completely forget what made us. That's my impression of Washington right now, I think they've completely forgotten, maybe they just need a reminder (November). Again, I think the world of both you and Matt, you both speak from the heart, I still hope to make it over there one day and take you up on dinner, maybe Matt can join us. Now remind me of why I got into this thread again, lol!!!!!

cableguyxx · Post by **cableguyxx** » Thu Mar 25, 2010 1:22 am

Ted, I think a vast majority of the people in the US have lost their "balls" so to speak. Everyone is so politically correct all the damn time. Sorry worried about hurting someone elses feelings. Not wanting to do the hardwork for themselves. We have lost our way...and I don't see it coming back in my lifetime. I believe Ben Franklin said this: "When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic." Unfortunately, that is where we are at. Very frustrated tonight. The people that make the hard choices and do the right thing continue to get screwed, and the people who make poor choices are continued to be coddled and rewarded. It's re-goddamn-diculous!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100324/ap_ ... _mortgages

I can't even get a re-fi because my balance is underwater, and I'm current on my loan, so they don't give fuck about me. I'm just a good paying customer (read dumbshit sucker).

tedeeoo · Post by **tedeeoo** » Thu Mar 25, 2010 1:41 am

balls=heart, I'm with you cableguyxx

RR-ElectricAngel · Post by **RR-ElectricAngel** » Thu Mar 25, 2010 4:03 am

The U.S. Constitution was not perfect and it has survived. My hope is that a health care system that treats it's citizens like human beings rather than cattle will have a decent chance of surviving as well. There will be lots of bumps in the road in the years ahead but I think it is better than letting Darwinism be the accepted norm. Never believe that an emergency will not set you back in life. They happen to EVERYONE. Maybe the U.S. needs a law to be humane. That really sounds sad to admit that...

Cpt Matt Sparrow · Post by **Cpt Matt Sparrow** » Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:59 am

cableguyxx wrote:Ted, I think a vast majority of the people in the US have lost their "balls" so to speak. Everyone is so politically correct all the damn time .

Sadly this is one of the similarities we do share

I hate all the silly buzz words society uses...little catch phrases lke "he grew up in a toxic environment" meaning his early years were terrible etc. I hate them almost as much as cliches like "back in the day" another popular phrase that means something and nothing (yes Darin I have woken up in a foul mood and am wearing your negative specs LOL)

"balls=heart" 100 percent agree!! but we must as a society in real life (and cybre life) be wary of people who use balls and heart as a license to be offensive. ie they hi jack a cause for another agenda.

We have seen some of those here at UR in the past although admitedly under bogus user names etc.
Ted, I mentioned the reference to America adopting a European way as a lot of the message boards I frequent are mainly filled with strong viewed republicans. I suppose I was being ironic a little as the type of comment that re occurs time after times on these boards is "damn it' the US is going the same way as Europe!"

Like I said we are very different (USA and UK) and different things work in different places. Over and out from me.

And Ted, before you ask (because you are a gentleman) everything is cool my friend. I had a night of strange dreams I have woke up with the most dire co ordination and I am dreading going to Auschwitz (my school I am leaving soon LOL)

Matt

cableguyxx · Post by **cableguyxx** » Thu Mar 25, 2010 1:45 pm

Cpt Matt Sparrow wrote:
cableguyxx wrote:Ted, I think a vast majority of the people in the US have lost their "balls" so to speak. Everyone is so politically correct all the damn time .
Sadly this is one of the similarities we do share
I hate all the silly buzz words society uses...little catch phrases lke "he grew up in a toxic environment" meaning his early years were terrible etc. I hate them almost as much as cliches like "back in the day" another popular phrase that means something and nothing (yes Darin I have woken up in a foul mood and am wearing your negative specs LOL)
Matt

Matt society has become filled with "victims". Everyone is a victim of something. Someone has wronged them somehow and now they deserve a hand up. This is exactly the mentality that governments LOVE. It is much easier to control a people when the people need to look to the government for their security and welfare. Governments encourage this with their "social" entitlement programs.

tedeeoo · Post by **tedeeoo** » Thu Mar 25, 2010 3:12 pm

Hey Matt,

I'm with you on dire co-ordination, my migraines have sucked this week (actually for about 3 weeks now). I am actually in a good mood though, it's Friday for me and I'm getting ready to rock-n-roll (literally, gigs booked all spring), that's a good thing. I sincerly hope I haven't offended you or anyone else with my thoughts here, as my grandpappy used to say, "it'll all come out in the wash".

Smile, it makes people wonder what you've been up to

Ted

Cpt Matt Sparrow · Post by **Cpt Matt Sparrow** » Thu Mar 25, 2010 4:59 pm

Cheers Ted

I appreciate the kind words. After I typed my grumpy message I went to swig a bottle of diet coke. It slipped through my hands bounced off the table and fizzed over the entire room while like a bottle of celebratory champagne it went ever where. My clean work trousers, the ironing board and the walls were soaked lol. More seriously somehow today I must have pushed the neck of my classical guitar too hard when I put it in it's case? What ever What i did the neck is almost broken:-( so off to the guitar doctors. Lol to get back on topic I am having to go private! Cheers Matt

cableguyxx · Post by **cableguyxx** » Thu Mar 25, 2010 5:34 pm

lol at the coke explosion! I've done the same thing, and it was because I was in a hurry and pissed off. I had to laugh at myself. What a tension breaker to douse yourself with carbonated beverage.

Post by **Trigger** » Thu Mar 25, 2010 6:48 pm

I must interject,
One,
I would have loved to see Matt covered in diet coke it would have been very funny indeed,
Two,
Ted though your comment was aimed at Matt don't feel bad or apologize about voicing an opinion because we are all friends here and it would be dishonest to hide your views.
In the past we had to jump through hoops when our chats got bitter, some seemed to take differing opinions personally. As a result exchanges sometimes became hijacked by the community trolls. Those days are long gone and we all know that the views shown are deeply felt and always considered, it is respect of each other and a sense of brotherhood that makes us all realize that nothing said is an insult.

One thing that we have learned is that Euro views vary from that of our North American friends, not always, but often.
My feeling is that amongst friends it is our duty to keep these hotter topics on the forum so that members from different continental locations can learn from others elsewhere about how similar problems are dealt with in different places.
Speaking for myself as a British Male I know that many Americans see us pompous and arrogant, we are viewed as a nation who are deferential to our monarch and respect our Queen and all she stands for, let me tell you 'No we fucking don't'! We are mainly Republican (in the purest sense of the word) and have no respect for our monarch and know nothing about her or wish to.
We are often Socialist, I remember Darin being stunned when I mentioned this the first time, Socialism is not communism! Which due to the Soviet Union wrongly being often call a Socialist nation polluted what most Americans understand Socialism to be. A socialist in the Soviet Union would have been imprisoned as a dangerous subversive, and it was the socialists who were first imprisoned by the by Hitler they were the first into the concentration camps and murdered in mass long before the ‘Final Solution’ that tried to rid the world of the Jews. Britain is a nation that though not Socialist by governance is a nation who's populace is Socialist on many principles even if they are from the political right or left.

Us Brit's because we had the most powerful and largest Empire in history don't view the world from within we view it outwardly, our news is mostly International and our education teaches us about the wider world.
Nobody should confuse the Empire with modern day Britain because we are ashamed of it and the dreadful things it inflicted on the peoples of the world. Maybe when viewing us, our opinions and our advice, try to bare in mind we are one of old oldest nations and we see take notice of other countries and the mistakes they make. When we criticize or query them we do it because we now have hindsight because we have made those mistakes and our education makes sure we understand just what we did and I feel we as individuals want to make sure those same mistakes are not repeated by firstly, us and by extension other nations, don’t mistake that as pompous this is caring and considerate.

tedeeoo · Post by **tedeeoo** » Thu Mar 25, 2010 7:02 pm

Ian,

It is in my nature to try and be nice to everyone, I am not apologizing for my views merely emphasizing that they are my own and not meant to hurt anyone's feelings. I do not recall in any of my posts or for that matter anywhere in my thoughts, saying or thinking that anyone was arrogant or pompous, if I insinuated that in any way please accept my apologies. I was only pointing out that America and Europe are in governmental terms, different, that is not to say that either is right or wrong in their approach, only different. Matt should just be glad it was a diet coke and not the coolant line off of an ICP-Mass Spectrophotometer, I did that one time and let me say it is no fun to be covered in anti-freeze, lol!!!

Ted

Post by **Trigger** » Thu Mar 25, 2010 7:23 pm

tedeeoo wrote:Ian,I do not recall in any of my posts or for that matter anywhere in my thoughts, saying or thinking that anyone was arrogant or pompous

You didn't say anything of the sort Ted

I was just pointing out that some people view us Brit's that way, I will add that I don't think that anyone here see us that way, my comments were related to the common misconception of the British.
You Ted are very respectful and I only hope that I am the same.

tedeeoo · Post by **tedeeoo** » Thu Mar 25, 2010 10:55 pm

I have nothing but respect for you Ian, you are first class all the way.

NicDots · Post by **NicDots** » Sun Mar 28, 2010 3:44 am

As for this health insurance bill...only time will tell.

oth · Post by **oth** » Sat Apr 03, 2010 8:02 am

RR-ElectricAngel wrote:My hope is that a health care system that treats it's citizens like human beings rather than cattle will have a decent chance of surviving as well....

how about a country/govt that cares more about its citizens than the profits of wall st and corporate america.Its appalling that many poor slobs actually think the govt shouldnt provide full coverage.Corporations always fight for whats in their best interest why dont avg hard working people?Why do poor slobs defend health insurance companies that screw them royally with annual 100% rate hikes or denial of coverage?The current cost of healthcare is already a massive tax.You get rid of private control and you will see more money in your pocket after all is said and done.Every country that has national healthcare pays half what we do and they all live longer!Healthcare shouldnt be a for-profit enterprise.Thats like having for-profit police,fire and military protection.I would think healthcare is the most important essential service even more than national defence or almost.
What s even more retarded is that extremists managed to demand that this bill must reduce the deficit.When was the last time they demanded a military budget reduce the deficit?Priorities are way fkd up here.