Lemmy's Book

[axeman_12656]

I do believe that Randy's untimely death made him an instant legend much like Dimebag, Jim Morrison and Kurt Cobain.

I disagree with the comment Lemmy makes about Randy not being the Innovator everyone makes him out to be now. Randy had a dedication and a desire that went deeper than any other player. Most, EVH included, just wanted to be rock stars. Randy's passion, dedication and knowledge went way beyond that.

[dasboot]

Yeah, I don't think Lemmy meant it as a put-down. He is just pointing out that Randy wasn't perceived the same when he was alive as after he died. This is no doubt true but at the same time we know Randy was on the verge of guitar hero status at the time of his death. I think Lemmy was referring to his status when he says 'guitar player' and is not referring to his abilities.

[zennman]

Had Eddie died after VH 2, we'd all be talking about his genius to no end. Eruption is and always will be the standard. However, Eddie has outlived his brilliance. If we were to hear him jam in private, I'm sure we'd all be amazed at what he can do.

Randy didn't live long enough to put out a bad record. If he had, his legend wouldn't be what it is. He is undoubtedly my favorite player and always will be, but he isn't the only brilliant innovator on the guitar like he's made out to be here.

Remember, Lemmy knew him, we don't. Therefore his opinion carries a bit more weight than ours in my opinion.

Hit the nail on the head! Very well put my friend. We definitely have put RR on a pedestal here. And I agree that RR didn't pioneer a whole new genre. But he was one of the first to infuse classical into metal (in a more tasteful way than others IMHO).

The thing that RR did was transmit a type of emotion through his playing that few are able to do to this day. His playing still makes the hair on my arm stand up. Randy didn't rely on too many parlor tricks in his playing (although he did do some flashy stuff) but what flash he did do always reflected deep intense emotion (OTM solo, etc), while there was always musical substance in his playing. It still speaks to me in a way that few other players do.

EVH can now be easily parodied with his style of playing (finger tapping etc). But RR was different. He didn't play Mr Crowley on every solo. Thank God for the different styles like on No Bone Movies, Dee, DOAM, etc... RR was very well rounded in his playing.

I think we mourn the potential that was lost on 03/19/82. I'm sure RR would have made a bad record in the future, but there would have even more greatness unfortunately that we will never hear...

[Paul Wolfe]

It should read; He isn't like James Dean or Sid Vicious. He had substance and a talent you could see and hear. Am I the only one that feels this way?

So you don't think James Dean had any talent?

he isn't the only brilliant innovator on the guitar like he's made out to be here.

Paul, I find that an inaccurate appraisal of the members here: In fact, I can't think of many members who don't have other favourite player/innovators etc, as well as Randy . The influences that people have shared with me over the years, has been very diverse. There are actually quite a few members too, whose favourite player isn't RR, but they still admire him etc!

It is a site about RR, so naturally his praises are sung here more than other musicians, just as if I log onto a Django Reinhardt website, the focus is about Django and The Hot Club Of Paris So yes, Randy is discussed more than others are, but then It is after all, a site honouring Randy Rhoads

Matt

Yes, Matt, the membership here has diverse influences. However, the tendency is to elevate Randy Rhoads to a level where he was the ultimate guitar player and no one ever played anything better than him. Yes it is a Randy site and his praises are sung highly, I get that, too. But if anyone says anything less than flattering, the attacks come out.

Put it this way, a LOT of people find it wrong that Randy's image has been whitewashed for decades. He was a perfect angel who never did anything wrong and was only about the music, sound familiar? So if we can say we want to know the 'real' Randy Rhoads, we have to be open to hearing things about him that are less than flattering.

And Matt, I didn't say there was anything wrong with Randy being discussed more than others. Discussing him is what this board is about. All I said was he was one of many greats and that needs to be kept in mind when reading comments from people like Lemmy.

Lemmy said he was good but not the brilliant guitarist legend has made him. Nothing wrong with that, Lemmy was there, so he knew Randy in a way we never will. That's what I tried to get across in my post. Lemmy never claimed to be great. He has, however had the opportunity to play with many outstanding musicians, which would add perspective to his comments about Randy.

[Paul Wolfe]

I think we mourn the potential that was lost on 03/19/82. I'm sure RR would have made a bad record in the future, but there would have even more greatness unfortunately that we will never hear...

Maybe not a bad record, but one that we didn't all like?

Again with Ed, Van Halen 3 is roundly criticized as a terrible record, but I find it to have a lot of great playing on it. If it were a Gary Cherone record and not a "Van Halen" record, I think it would be considered much more positively. We want to here certain things when we here Van Halen (like the first 4 records and little else), so VH3 was shunned by the masses.

That very well could have happened with Randy, but it didn't because of his short time here.

[zennman]

I think Randy might have made the same mistakes that EVH did (creative mistakes, not necessarily record sales mistakes as Van-Hagar was extremely popular) . RR was listening to Phil Collins and other pop music when he died. And the keyboards were mysteriously dominate on the DOAM tour. I wonder if he would have done any similar keyboard driven music, given his personal tastes at the time?

[Cpt Matt Sparrow]

Hi Paul

It is this quote I answered ...

he isn't the only brilliant innovator on the guitar like he's made out to be here.

with this answer

Paul, I find that an inaccurate appraisal of the members here: In fact, I can't think of many members who don't have other favourite player/innovators etc, as well as Randy . The influences that people have shared with me over the years, has been very diverse. There are actually quite a few members too, whose favourite player isn't RR, but they still admire him etc!
Matt

So to reiterate, and bring it back to the point you said about members not accepting other "brilliant innovators". Talk to the members and you will find they do!
Without writing a long list of all the members that have many other musical heros they love, I can tell you that the mods/admin love other musicians work as equally as RR.

Yes it is a Randy site and his praises are sung highly, I get that, too. But if anyone says anything less than flattering, the attacks come out.

Not here they don't , we have discussed all manner of things from Randy sleeping with Sharon, some people not liking aspects of his tone (like Nicole and myself who don't like his Blizzard tone) as well as drug use etc. Hardly a site trying to protect a saintly image???

Put it this way, a LOT of people find it wrong that Randy's image has been whitewashed for decades. He was a perfect angel who never did anything wrong and was only about the music, sound familiar? So if we can say we want to know the 'real' Randy Rhoads, we have to be open to hearing things about him that are less than flattering.

Again I haven't seen that much/atall here so cannot agree with you Paul. There are always those that do wish to be in a community that keeps things locked and private and that doesn't allow Randy's music/personality to be questioned etc, I assure you, this isn't one of them...say what you want.

Matt

[whoopiecat]

Well, it's been said by the folks who knew him that his plans after university were to get something going that was driven by guitar and keyboards, along the lines of Styx and Boston.
I suppose the last thing Randy had worked on that might offer a glimpse would be the band jam that developed during the Diary tour.
I've said this before, but those of us who came up in the eighties have been carrying the image and knowledge given to us by the tribute feature Jas Obrecht did for the 11/82 issue of Guitar Player, along with the pieces from John Stix and Wolf Marshall had written for the Guitar For The Practising Musician mag as well.
I'm not saying we were misled by them or that is was sensationalism in the press, but Randy did and does have this untarnished image simply because he wasn't around long enough to fuck it up.
We read from his family and peers that all he did was play guitar...study it, teach it and rock it. He is remembered well by all who knew him and no one has ever had a negative thing to say.
He will forever be a young, handsome guy, with a great talent presented on only two seminal studio efforts, which folks still point to today.
There was no failed solo album, or embarrassing guest appearance. No bad press from being caught with an underage groupie, or detoxing from a cocaine problem. He left before the genre got silly with spandex and lipstick and schmaltz. No headbands to cover up the hair loss or sleeve tattoos to cover the track marks.
Like Paul said, Lemmy knew Randy. Keep in mind, Lemmy has kicked the shit out of himself for decades with speed and booze. Maybe that's just his way of expressing things.
He was one of the folks present for the Rockwalk induction, whether it was the Rhoads' or the Osbournes who invited him, he still made the effort to show up, which was a lot more than Kevin DuBrow ever did.
I know Lemmy is talking about actual technique as far as innovation goes, but Randy is probably the main reason Jackson guitars is in business today.

[dasboot]

In emotional expression, tone, and note selection RR remains unsurpassed in my book although I am an avid guitar buff and have listened to much. He was a singular talent and that's why everyone still misses him after so many years.

[zennman]

He left before the genre got silly with spandex and lipstick and schmaltz

Schmaltz? You mixing Schlitz beer with malts again?

[GUITARIDOL5682]

Guitaridol one question? In 1980, Motorhead or Ozzy? If you could only have one? Sort of a Sofie's choice moment. If Motorhead, why are you not on a Motorhead, Hawkwind, Lemmy website?
P.S. - I just added Hawkwind to the spellchecker...

To answer your question in 1980 i was a big fan of Motorhead but i didn't have a favourite band at the time. Motorhead had released more albums at the time so i couldn't say i liked Ozzy more as he'd only released the single Crazy Train. Motorhead had 4 albums out and if you liked Hawkwind you'd be more of a Lemmy Motorhead fan. Just to give you an idea. I liked many bands Scorpions UFO Triumph Rainbow AC/DC Judas Priest Thin Lizzy. I would of said out of all the bands mentioned i was a big Thin Lizzy fan. When i say i liked these bands, i went to see them in concert and bought all the records.
Yeah i am a member of the imotorhead.com forum.
Someone mentioned who was Bob Calvert he was the singer of Hawkwind. He died in 1988 of a heartattack. Lemmy mentioned he became more noticed when he was dead then alive. Very much like Randy which is more to the point Lemmy is trying to put over. What direction would of he went too as far as being an innovator ? We'll never be able to answer that one...

[GUITARIDOL5682]

I bet Lemmy is remembered more then Randy when he does finally die.

You can also bet that Lemmy wont be on guitar or rock magazine covers 6months let alone 30yrs after he passes.Lemmys legend always has been his image and persona.He has funny stories sure.
Personally i find his persona a bit contrived and boring.And what isnt contrived is alcohol induced-nothing to be admired or respected really.Lemmy is the guy in black leathrr at the Rainbow at end of the bar glued to video slot machines.Wow.
I saw him a few yrs ago standing outside a store in 100 degrees in his dated black attire. Pleeeease.

Well Motorhead are still out there now doing it.... Very much like AC/DC who lost Bon Scott and he is still very much seen in magazines and he's been dead 30+ years. So i don't think you can say he'll dissappear into obscurity. Shit if it wasn't for us fans of RR i think he would be well forgoting.

[oth]

I bet Lemmy is remembered more then Randy when he does finally die.

Well Motorhead are still out there now doing it.... Very much like AC/DC who lost Bon Scott and he is still very much seen in magazines and he's been dead 30+ years. So i don't think you can say he'll dissappear into obscurity. Shit if it wasn't for us fans of RR i think he would be well forgoting.

Randy's influence dwarfs lemmys.
Randy,evh,page,hendrix are the guys that get mentioned ad nauseaum as musical influences.Lemmy...not.
Maybe he gets props for his great story telling etc or attitude.I dont mind motorhead but it is not musical genius stuff to put it mildly.

[cableguyxx]

Randys stuff is as mind blowing to me today as it was when i became a convert in 83.Just the same for me as Jimi or EVH.
I was a die hard hippy and hated metal when boo and diary came out(strangely enough i had and listened to ace of spades lp a lot).
Although i wasnt yet a fan, when i would hear crazy train and over the mountain and flyin high the guitar playing really stood out-not that i was a fan of it but it was hard not to take notice.Thats what legends do,they make the unaware very aware.

Damn dude, that was very well said Honestly, Lemmy's opinion of him doesn't mean squat to me, whether he knew him or not. Whether it's true or not, most of the time comments like these come across as someone being a bit jealous. Same as Eddie's comments. All I know is, when I heard him play it freaked me out. I was listening to some heavy stuff at the time (Journey, Billy Squire, etc.. ) but there was just something so unique sounding in what he played. I like other guitar players, but no one else has ever come close to having that affect on me. It's hard to explain. I've always said Randy had something in his playing that was like a dog whistle that only certain people can hear the same way.

[Tito]

well put cable!!!!