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 Post subject: Re: Diary of a Madman Concert Footage
PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2014 2:06 am 
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No1UNo wrote:
Nick,

I think the Capitol Theater footage issue is a bit more complex...

Steve Machat, lawyer for Don Arden (Jet Records) states in his book, "Gods, Gangsters, and Honor" that he sold the Capitol Theater footage to MusicMaker.com, Inc., for Don Arden (who owned it and all copyrights) in the late 90's for $100,000. Although the book doesn't list this show by name, there were enough references to it (by Randy in a postcard to Jody, and by Ozzy's tour manager) that this is probably one of the only multi-camera pro-shot shows of Ozzy and Randy, because every band was always filmed by in-house cameras when they played that venue.

IF the Capitol still has this show in its archives - or at least a copy of it, they most likely don't own the copyright and can't do anything with it. MusicMaker.com, Inc. went out of business, so who knows what happened to the footage and copyright that Machat sold to them. I wouldn't doubt that it's sitting in a warehouse somewhere collecting dust as liquidated assets of the defunct company, or that it was sold again to someone else who is enjoying it privately, when the business was liquidated as it went through bankruptcy proceedings.

I live in Boston. If I talked to someone connected to Capitol and they said they had the footage, my reply would be, "I'll be there in 4 hours if I can just see the reel of film - and perhaps a screening to verify it is what you say it is."

So, while I believe this footage is real and still out there, it ever seeing the light of day is another matter entirely. But I also believe that someone following the right trail who is determined to verify that it exists would, in fact, be able to do so with a bit of research and hard work.


I have the book Gods Gangsters,Honor.. and it says the footage Don sold was actually the Mtv Irvine (commonally refered to as the Speak of the Devil) show with Brad Gillis... So the mystery continues..

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 Post subject: Re: Diary of a Madman Concert Footage
PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2014 2:50 am 
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No1UNo wrote:
Nick,

I think the Capitol Theater footage issue is a bit more complex...

Steve Machat, lawyer for Don Arden (Jet Records) states in his book, "Gods, Gangsters, and Honor" that he sold the Capitol Theater footage to MusicMaker.com, Inc., for Don Arden (who owned it and all copyrights) in the late 90's for $100,000. Although the book doesn't list this show by name, there were enough references to it (by Randy in a postcard to Jody, and by Ozzy's tour manager) that this is probably one of the only multi-camera pro-shot shows of Ozzy and Randy, because every band was always filmed by in-house cameras when they played that venue.

IF the Capitol still has this show in its archives - or at least a copy of it, they most likely don't own the copyright and can't do anything with it. MusicMaker.com, Inc. went out of business, so who knows what happened to the footage and copyright that Machat sold to them. I wouldn't doubt that it's sitting in a warehouse somewhere collecting dust as liquidated assets of the defunct company, or that it was sold again to someone else who is enjoying it privately, when the business was liquidated as it went through bankruptcy proceedings.

I live in Boston. If I talked to someone connected to Capitol and they said they had the footage, my reply would be, "I'll be there in 4 hours if I can just see the reel of film - and perhaps a screening to verify it is what you say it is."

So, while I believe this footage is real and still out there, it ever seeing the light of day is another matter entirely. But I also believe that someone following the right trail who is determined to verify that it exists would, in fact, be able to do so with a bit of research and hard work.


I know the footage exists because I have confirmation from the head of the Captial Theater
AND a source I can't name publicly

He is very reliable


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 Post subject: Re: Diary of a Madman Concert Footage
PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 12:20 am 
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Nick,

You need to carefully and steadfastly pursue any leads that you have. A reliable source at the defunct Capitol Theater wouldn't balk at snapping a photo of the reel or (if possible) sending you a screen shot from the live footage itself. I, personally, would drive down to meet anyone connected to any live footage from this venue, if only to see something with my own eyes for 8 hours of driving.

But, having the book also and having read it thoroughly, I can find nowhere that states that this was positively the Irvine Meadows show with Brad Gillis. In fact, the Irvine show aired on MTV way back in 1982 or 1983 when the network was just getting started...you know, when they used to play videos and concerts. At that time, for it to air, Ozzy or Jet would've had to have held the copyright and wanted to put it on for purposes of publicizing Ozzy's career. Even if Don Arden held the copyright and allowed this to be aired, I don't think you get MusicMaker.com, Inc., to pay $100,000 for a concert that has already aired with a fill-in guitarist almost 20 years later.

Machat knew the Blizzard of Ozz and how important Rhoads was to Ozzy - both as a songwriter and as a performer. He also knew that virtually no pro-shot footage of Rhoads with Ozzy existed at that point. Don knew its value as well, and this leads me to believe that the footage Machat brokered the sale for Don Arden was new and different footage than anything that was previously out there. If I had read that Machat had sold the Irvine Meadows show for $100,000 in his book, I seriously would've wondered what kind of wool he pulled over someone's eyes to get something for a show that was okay (from what I remember from MTV), and was floating around in Europe and other places as a bootleg for a while.


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 Post subject: Re: Diary of a Madman Concert Footage
PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 6:44 am 
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Nick Hughes wrote:
I know the footage exists because I have confirmation from the head of the Captial Theater
AND a source I can't name publicly

He is very reliable


This is from '05:

whitewolf wrote:
Well, I tried. I had high hopes, but it was not to be... this time.
I have seen a list of the Capitol Theatre's surviving tapes (as I mentioned earlier in another thread) owned by John Scher of Metropolitan Entertainment (who incidentally owned the Theatre for its entire glorious lifespan). There are many wonderful concert videos on this list, but the bad news is, the shows I was looking for (including the 1981 Ozzy show) are not listed in this collection... which can only mean that, assuming the theatre did film this particular Ozzy concert (and I don't know why they wouldn't), it only stands to reason that someone must have taken the tape after the show, as it stands that it’s no longer in the vault.
Anyways, so again the question remains... where is the tape and who has it? The Osbournes? Maybe Ozzy's voice was sub-par that night (what else is new?) and Sharon (armed with some ulterior motive) didn't want the tape in public circulation, so she snagged it???


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 Post subject: Re: Diary of a Madman Concert Footage
PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 5:15 pm 
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Paul Wolfe wrote:
Nick Hughes wrote:
I know the footage exists because I have confirmation from the head of the Captial Theater
AND a source I can't name publicly

He is very reliable


This is from '05:

whitewolf wrote:
Well, I tried. I had high hopes, but it was not to be... this time.
I have seen a list of the Capitol Theatre's surviving tapes (as I mentioned earlier in another thread) owned by John Scher of Metropolitan Entertainment (who incidentally owned the Theatre for its entire glorious lifespan). There are many wonderful concert videos on this list, but the bad news is, the shows I was looking for (including the 1981 Ozzy show) are not listed in this collection... which can only mean that, assuming the theatre did film this particular Ozzy concert (and I don't know why they wouldn't), it only stands to reason that someone must have taken the tape after the show, as it stands that it’s no longer in the vault.
Anyways, so again the question remains... where is the tape and who has it? The Osbournes? Maybe Ozzy's voice was sub-par that night (what else is new?) and Sharon (armed with some ulterior motive) didn't want the tape in public circulation, so she snagged it???


To be fair, that was 9 years ago. I'm assuming Scher knew the value of the tape and new that if he said he had it, people would be all over him for it so he decided to not publicize that the tape is in is possession.

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 Post subject: Re: Diary of a Madman Concert Footage
PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 5:23 pm 
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LongRhoadsAhead wrote:
To be fair, that was 9 years ago. I'm assuming Scher knew the value of the tape and new that if he said he had it, people would be all over him for it so he decided to not publicize that the tape is in is possession.


Yes, nine years... what's the difference between then and now? The date. There is no more interest in this show now than there was then, in fact there is probably less interest now. Why would he not say he had it then and now there is a "cannot be named publicly" source saying it exists? Doesn't make sense.


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 Post subject: Re: Diary of a Madman Concert Footage
PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 5:30 pm 
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oops messed up the order here...lol


Last edited by TAB on Sat May 10, 2014 5:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Diary of a Madman Concert Footage
PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 5:30 pm 
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Paul Wolfe wrote:
LongRhoadsAhead wrote:
To be fair, that was 9 years ago. I'm assuming Scher knew the value of the tape and new that if he said he had it, people would be all over him for it so he decided to not publicize that the tape is in is possession.


Yes, nine years... what's the difference between then and now? The date. There is no more interest in this show now than there was then, in fact there is probably less interest now. Why would he not say he had it then and now there is a "cannot be named publicly" source saying it exists? Doesn't make sense.


He also said confirmation from the owner though

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 Post subject: Re: Diary of a Madman Concert Footage
PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 5:31 pm 
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Doesn't' seem like 9 years I thought it wasn't until Off the Rails came out but I have been known to lose track of time but.

It may be a similar type thing that happened to Bruce Lee Game of Death footage. The reels could have been mislabeled or stored in other bands reels from that year. Basically they found GOD footage on the end of another reel piled away with a bunch of other reels. Course that's just one guess. I believe Sher was going to sell his lot of tapes to a production company. I don't know if it actually happened ? I will just say it was filmed and I won't go into anything else far as why I know.


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 Post subject: Re: Diary of a Madman Concert Footage
PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 5:51 pm 
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TAB wrote:
Doesn't' seem like 9 years I thought it wasn't until Off the Rails came out but I have been known to lose track of time but.

It may be a similar type thing that happened to Bruce Lee Game of Death footage. The reels could have been mislabeled or stored in other bands reels from that year. Basically they found GOD footage on the end of another reel piled away with a bunch of other reels. Course that's just one guess. I believe Sher was going to sell his lot of tapes to a production company. I don't know if it actually happened ? I will just say it was filmed and I won't go into anything else far as why I know.


Thanks T.A. I can only imagine how great that footage is!

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 Post subject: Re: Diary of a Madman Concert Footage
PostPosted: Sun May 11, 2014 12:50 am 
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no problem, if you go to that capitol theater facebook there is footage from 80 or 81 of Allman Bros., I am sure the Ozzy stuff looks exactly like that. Sux it's black and white but hell, take what we can get.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtMglhd ... e=youtu.be


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 Post subject: Re: Diary of a Madman Concert Footage
PostPosted: Sun May 11, 2014 5:08 am 
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No1UNo wrote:
Nick,

You need to carefully and steadfastly pursue any leads that you have. A reliable source at the defunct Capitol Theater wouldn't balk at snapping a photo of the reel or (if possible) sending you a screen shot from the live footage itself. I, personally, would drive down to meet anyone connected to any live footage from this venue, if only to see something with my own eyes for 8 hours of driving.

But, having the book also and having read it thoroughly, I can find nowhere that states that this was positively the Irvine Meadows show with Brad Gillis. In fact, the Irvine show aired on MTV way back in 1982 or 1983 when the network was just getting started...you know, when they used to play videos and concerts. At that time, for it to air, Ozzy or Jet would've had to have held the copyright and wanted to put it on for purposes of publicizing Ozzy's career. Even if Don Arden held the copyright and allowed this to be aired, I don't think you get MusicMaker.com, Inc., to pay $100,000 for a concert that has already aired with a fill-in guitarist almost 20 years later.

Machat knew the Blizzard of Ozz and how important Rhoads was to Ozzy - both as a songwriter and as a performer. He also knew that virtually no pro-shot footage of Rhoads with Ozzy existed at that point. Don knew its value as well, and this leads me to believe that the footage Machat brokered the sale for Don Arden was new and different footage than anything that was previously out there. If I had read that Machat had sold the Irvine Meadows show for $100,000 in his book, I seriously would've wondered what kind of wool he pulled over someone's eyes to get something for a show that was okay (from what I remember from MTV), and was floating around in Europe and other places as a bootleg for a while.

Yeah I just reread my gangsters gods honor book and it doesnt say what footage he actually has but i read it somehwere that it was the mtv show...

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 Post subject: Re: Diary of a Madman Concert Footage
PostPosted: Wed Oct 01, 2014 8:13 pm 
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devorerd wrote:
Wish it was true, but based on time, someone would have leaked it by now...Nothing more than a myth...Wish I was wrong. I mean, how long do you think Sharon had the Mexico two songs, + plus the other we got? If she had this (the whole show), it could have generated major bucks, pro shot... If you think about it about it what is the next milestone, 40 years?



This isn't addressed to just this comment but the many a times that I've seen Sharon referenced in the search of Randy footage. Is there any proof that the Osbournes, mainly Sharon, were holding onto Randy footage until the box set release? Or proof that Sharon/Ozzy currently have footage but they just won't release it.

I've read so many accusations but I don't recall seeing anyone back them up with evidence. I know Sharon isn't liked for how she handles certain things so please don't misunderstand my comment but I'm curious.


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 Post subject: Re: Diary of a Madman Concert Footage
PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2014 3:38 pm 
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There's no "proof" of anything - what Sharon has or what is even out there - just speculation.

The idea that a full concert video with Randy would generate "big bucks" is speculation as well. That kind of stuff doesn't sell all that well anymore... hardcore fans would buy it, sure, but most would wait for the torrent or YouTube posting... so if the O's have anything, it'll probably never be released because there's not enough money to be made to make it worth their while.

As an example, the Andrew Klein book cost a lot to make and he didn't even break even from what I've heard. We talk about what we'd like to have, but not too many are willing (or can afford to) put their money where their mouth is.


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 Post subject: Re: Diary of a Madman Concert Footage
PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2014 3:54 pm 
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Paul Wolfe wrote:
There's no "proof" of anything - what Sharon has or what is even out there - just speculation.

The idea that a full concert video with Randy would generate "big bucks" is speculation as well. That kind of stuff doesn't sell all that well anymore... hardcore fans would buy it, sure, but most would wait for the torrent or YouTube posting... so if the O's have anything, it'll probably never be released because there's not enough money to be made to make it worth their while.

As an example, the Andrew Klein book cost a lot to make and he didn't even break even from what I've heard. We talk about what we'd like to have, but not too many are willing (or can afford to) put their money where their mouth is.


I assumed it was all speculation and thanks for chiming in.

I plan to buy the Quiet Riot Years book/DVD in the near future. It's funny that on Amazon and eBay that book/DVD sites around the $90 mark but you can get it off the site for $69.99.

http://www.redmatchproductions.com/Buy-Here.html


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