Steven Rosen and Andrew Klein Book Excerpt

[CanuckRhoadsFan]

Would be good to know some of the stuff though that he did do

Like I said, "IF" what was in the book is true, I lost a lot of respect. That said, I don't hold this thing as gospel as anyone who I personally have spoken to was conveniently left out of the book.

It read almost like there was an agenda to debunk the 'nice guy' image. My question is, what's wrong with people believing Randy was a good guy? Why go out of your way to make him look like a juvenile ass? Again "if" this portrayal was accurate, I'd say that the times he got his ass kicked by 'jocks', he probably deserved it for some stupid prank he pulled on them.

Until someone I know who knew Randy can verify the image this book portrays, I'll chalk it up to the Klein/Margolis attitude. If the documentary was like the book, I can see why it was canned.

I'm curious which parts of the book led you to this conclusion, Paul. Can you elaborate?

I read it and also thought it brought down the "St. Rhoads" angle quite a bit, but, like yourself, I question the authors a bit as well. The bias is there, but not enough to detract me from liking the book a lot.

It's certainly one of the best Randy resources out there, no doubt. As with everything, though, corroborating "facts" is sometimes problematic, and ideally, two or three other sources saying something similar might lead one to believe that there might be some validity in what is being claimed. However, it certainly does pay to try and get to the bottom of facts, and at the same time, think critically about what you read. Usually, one side says one thing, another side says another, and the truth is somewhere in the middle. I always tend to question things myself, as in, "what's the angle here?".

That being said, I stand by my comments of the book being a solid piece of work, and well worth owning for Randy fans. I don't think the book smears Randy's name in the least, but it does remind us that he had his issues, just like the rest of us. In that way, it's good at refuting the "official" "Randy was a saint" party line that we've been fed for years.

Rosen and Klein did some solid work here, but ABSOLUTELY we as readers should question it, as with any piece of writing.

Interesting that you cite Ace Frehley, Paul. I would also agree with you that he's a guy whose musical contributions were great, but he was a less than savoury character in other aspects. I think he rode the fame train, used it for what it was worth, and then was resentful that it ended with his firing from KISS. I don't know that I would consider Randy in the same way, but I get where you're coming from. I think they were at different levels on a similar, but not the same, spectrum. I don't think Randy was a saint by any means, but I don't think he achieved the Ace Frehley level of douchebaggery, either. It's a tough call.

Now I'm going to have to go back and read sections of the book again!

[Tito]

whenever you read a biograghy one book isnt gonna give u the answer your looking for in any individual..read 4,5,6 books from different authors then make your own conclusion.even people close to a person for some reason tend to sugarcoat human flaws especially after they have died.

[Paul Wolfe]

Would be good to know some of the stuff though that he did do

Like I said, "IF" what was in the book is true, I lost a lot of respect. That said, I don't hold this thing as gospel as anyone who I personally have spoken to was conveniently left out of the book.

It read almost like there was an agenda to debunk the 'nice guy' image. My question is, what's wrong with people believing Randy was a good guy? Why go out of your way to make him look like a juvenile ass? Again "if" this portrayal was accurate, I'd say that the times he got his ass kicked by 'jocks', he probably deserved it for some stupid prank he pulled on them.

Until someone I know who knew Randy can verify the image this book portrays, I'll chalk it up to the Klein/Margolis attitude. If the documentary was like the book, I can see why it was canned.

I'm curious which parts of the book led you to this conclusion, Paul. Can you elaborate?

It was things like throwing a girl's shoes into the fireplace and watching them melt. Scraping his food into some random person's hood just for a laugh, calling his girlfriend fat because it amused him and, most of all, punching his first girlfriend during a fight. None of that behavior is acceptable in my world and it wasn't when I was a kid, either.

I've done my share of drinking and being crazy, but not at the expense anyone else. I did that one time in junior high and I regretted it immediately and wen to the kids house and apologized.

I've talked with some people tonight who were not consulted for the book and they have assured me, Randy was not the guy portrayed in that book. I've read every book out there on Randy now except Ron Sobol's book and this is the first one to portray Randy as a jerk. Kelly G made it clear that he wasn't an angel, but didn't go to the level Klein did.

As for my mention of Ace, I didn't mean Randy was like him, I meant I love Ace's guitar work but not necessarily his lifestyle. For the record, though, he quit both times, he wasn't fired. He also doesn't seem to have any regrets or anger about not being in the band now, he has anger towards the way he former bandmates have spoken about him and treated him.

In the end, I'd just say this book is garbage for anyone wanting to learn about Randy Rhoads. The only only information I got out of the book I found worthwhile was that he never talked to Drew about leaving to join Ozzy and that his polka dot V only had 21 frets. Other than that I could live without anything else written in that book.

The pictures are cool, though.

Oh, and now I know where Shaun got the idea that Kelle and Kathy didn't like Randy until after he died and they could "make a buck" off of him.

[shred1]

In the end, I'd just say this book is garbage for anyone wanting to learn about Randy Rhoads.

That comment sounds like someone that just found out that Santa isn't real. A little overstated.
Why can't RR be human? I haven't read the book in question, but what you have alluded to doesn't come close to the reckless behaviour of Ace Frehley.... not even in the same ballpark.

RR was in rock bands since his early teens... he saw it all during his tenure on the Strip with QR.... before he was 'famous'. Don't kid yourself.

A thorn in my side.... RR never said he was an angel, everyone else perpetuated that myth. He was an average guy, with above average guitar skills.
Look at the man's guitars, his haircut, his clothes. He was rocker. If his mother said otherwise, I would disagree.
Would Randy tell his mother about all the 'goings on' backstage at the aftershow? No.

[Paul Wolfe]

In the end, I'd just say this book is garbage for anyone wanting to learn about Randy Rhoads.

That comment sounds like someone that just found out that Santa isn't real. A little overstated.
Why can't RR be human? I haven't read the book in question, but what you have alluded to doesn't come close to the reckless behaviour of Ace Frehley.... not even in the same ballpark.\

Is English your native language? I said the comparison to Ace being that I liked the music but not the behavior of the person. That doesn't mean they behaved exactly the same, it means they both displayed behavior I don't approve of - according to Klein's book. If you haven't read the book, you should stay out of the conversation.

As for the Santa comment, I've been around and seen enough to know Randy was a "normal" kid and not a saint, so anyone who wants to go that route can just save it.

Think of it this way, have you done anything in your life you are not proud of or wouldn't want to shout from the rooftops for the world to hear? Why won't most of you use your real names? Because you want a modicum of privacy. So what's wrong with Randy's mom wanting the focus to be on all of the positive aspects of her son's life? Ever hear the saying if you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all?

My point is, Kelly Garni managed to write a book showing Randy as human without making him look like an ass. Andrew Klein was pissed that Pete Margolis blew his shot with the documentary and wanted to hurt the Rhoads family so he published this book. As I've mentioned, it looks like they didn't bother to have a professional proofreader or a professional editor go over the text prior to printing. It was poorly written and poorly formatted as far as the text goes. Even if every word is true, a 9th grader could have written as well. Not a good thing for someone asking $99 for a book.

[GUITARIDOL5682]

Paul your a strange dude i like how you can give a book your review and put your opinion across on this subject. OK you think Randy has dropped a peg or two in the respect department. Sometimes we get to hear about icons and we hear stuff we don't like. I'd hate to be a Lostprophets fan after the recent antics from the lead singer. But he sounds like a pure weirdo and should be locked up for life. But we don't know 100% how these people tick, we aren't close enough to give them a true perspective of who that person is. If the Rhoads wrote a book it would be sugar coated as they frown on anything that taints his squeaky clean image. Kelly Garni spoke out about Randy and gave a more realistic image of him you have read his book and have defended Kelly when he's been wronged. But you did give his book the vote of approval. The Klein book is made up of interviews and mostly from the people who knew him the best. The things you've picked up on are petty and if you think his image should be tainted because of juvenile immature antics. OK Randy was immature so does that make him a person of lesser stature. I'm sure he wasn't an ass all the time. The book is showing you he wasn't this angelic person because he liked to pull practical jokes. Pissing in a glass and getting a waitress to taste it. Filling someone's hood with food, it's pure school kid antics. But it doesn't make me have less respect for the guy. Paul i think it's down to your Christian beliefs and i'm sure you want Randy to be the same and do no wrong. Thank God it was only practical jokes as if he was anything like Ian Watkins i'm sure the Randy collection would be in the dumpster. Just for the record i had Kathy and Kelle's cards marked well before i read this book.

[Paul Wolfe]

Paul your a strange dude i like how you can give a book your review and put your opinion across on this subject.

Isn't that what we all do here? We give our opinions?

OK you think Randy has dropped a peg or two in the respect department

Yes.

Paul i think it's down to your Christian beliefs...

You are 100% correct. I base everything on my beliefs.

I don't "want" Randy to be anything, I simply said that "IF" Randy was the person described in this book, I have no respect for him. I LOVE listening to KISS, but I don't respect anyone in that band.

[shred1]

Your are rather judgemental and damning for a man of faith, Mr. Wolfe.

[Paul Wolfe]

Your are rather judgemental and damning for a man of faith, Mr. Wolfe.

Where am I being damning and judgmental?

Because I don't respect people who behave like jackasses? That's not damning OR judgmental. That's simple saying I don't respect the person if he or she chooses to behave that way.

Or maybe it's because I am negative towards Peter Margolis and his buddy Andrew Klein? That is based on their behavior here and at RR.US. Peter Margolis earned my disrespect.

Maybe it's because I gave a negative review of the book? It was poorly written.

OR is it this:

Is English your native language? I said the comparison to Ace being that I liked the music but not the behavior of the person. That doesn't mean they behaved exactly the same, it means they both displayed behavior I don't approve of - according to Klein's book. If you haven't read the book, you should stay out of the conversation.

You made a comment which led me to believe you didn't understand what I said, so I explained it. Do I know you are a native English speaker? Nope. You talked down to me and I simply said if you didn't read it you can't comment on it.

For the record, you have also earned disrespect based on your behavior over the years. You have issues with me? C'est la vie

[Shockwave]

It was things like throwing a girl's shoes into the fireplace and watching them melt. Scraping his food into some random person's hood just for a laugh, calling his girlfriend fat because it amused him and, most of all, punching his first girlfriend during a fight. None of that behavior is acceptable in my world and it wasn't when I was a kid, either.

Throwing a girls shoes in a fireplace or scraping food into peoples hood's really got you that upset? I don't know where you grew up or if your parents were rich and not socialize or be part of the middle/lower class, but stuff like that is all common stuff kids do. I grew up through out the 80's and 90s and we did a ton of worse stuff than that and more often most likely.

The punching a girl thing, of course it's not right, I have not read the book and have no idea bout the situation behind why he did it. Maybe his legs were tied back and she was kicking him in the nads repeatedly over and over. His only way out of it was to punch her when she was coming in for a kick. Something like that would be legit//acceptable.

[Paul Wolfe]

No I didn't grow up rich. Yes I saw people do all kinds of things worse than that. However, the girl had to pay for the shoes, right? What would you do if someone set your stuff on fire?

By the way, those were just a couple examples, not the entirety of what I had issues with.

You did stuff worse than that? Then you were probably a jerk as a youngster as well. Doesn't mean you are now...

This s the way it works, I have a set of values, when people behave in a way that goes against those values I am offended. You know what's wrong with this planet? The number 1 issue? Too many people make allowances for bad behavior rather than holding everyone to a moral standard. "Oh, their just kids" "Oh everyone is doing it"

I refuse to live that way.

[Tito]

ok i do dont believe in organized religion nor do i practice,even tho i was raised roman catholic..i do believe in god..but this is for "everyone" on this forum...JUDGE NOT,THAT YOU BE NOT JUDGED...i think this saying should be practiced no matter what you believe in......now carry on gentlemen/ladies...

[shred1]

Because I don't respect people who behave like jackasses? That's not damning OR judgmental.

Who are you to say what is jackass behaviour and what is fairly normal adolescent behaviour?
Get off your high horse!

No, not judgemental at all. unless you live under a rock.

This s the way it works

The world according to St Paul.

[CanuckRhoadsFan]

No I didn't grow up rich. Yes I saw people do all kinds of things worse than that. However, the girl had to pay for the shoes, right? What would you do if someone set your stuff on fire?

By the way, those were just a couple examples, not the entirety of what I had issues with.

You did stuff worse than that? Then you were probably a jerk as a youngster as well. Doesn't mean you are now...

This s the way it works, I have a set of values, when people behave in a way that goes against those values I am offended. You know what's wrong with this planet? The number 1 issue? Too many people make allowances for bad behavior rather than holding everyone to a moral standard. "Oh, their just kids" "Oh everyone is doing it"

I refuse to live that way.

While I agree that society is far too permissive about many things, Paul, I also think that many things in life are not simply black or white. To not hear all sides of something is an unfortunate, unfair, and naive way to look at things. Making snap judgements about things usually leads to trouble. To play Devil's Advocate here for a second, didn't you say earlier that IF the info about Randy was true, then you'd lose respect for him? You're operating on the premise that it IS true already, after stating that you question Klein and Rosen.

And to quote and paraphrase Voltaire, "I may not agree with what you say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it" comes into play here. By that I mean that I may not agree with you at all times, but it is indeed YOUR right to be offended. Others may not hold the same beliefs.

I say the above not to be critical, but to try to be objective.

[CanuckRhoadsFan]

ok i do dont believe in organized religion nor do i practice,even tho i was raised roman catholic..i do believe in god..but this is for "everyone" on this forum...JUDGE NOT,THAT YOU BE NOT JUDGED...i think this saying should be practiced no matter what you believe in......now carry on gentlemen/ladies...

Tito, that's a great sentiment, but let's be honest; this forum is full of people who judge what others say, myself included. It's not going to change. Forums are places where people disagree. I think it's fine to debate someone philosophically on here, but for goodness sake, don't dislike the person! People need to be able to understand healthy, mature debate better here. At times, that does not happen, and many people are responsible for that. That seems to be the nature of this forum, for better or worse.