On Bob and Lee's input

[GUITARIDOL5682]

Ozzy cannot write shit ...he had to get his autobiography ghost writing he's dyslexic and his biggest contribution in the early days was 'Wine is Fine etc etc'. He was on a programme, on TV last night and out of all his music he picked up on 'MaMa I'm coming Home'. He even said that Lemmy wrote it for him. Everynight when i play that song i get a tingle down my spine. He'd get a better tingle if he wrote something of any caliber. FFS...

[sytharnia]

Everynight when i play that song i get a tingle down my spine. He'd get a better tingle if he wrote something of any caliber. FFS...

what a load of BS...who cares what he wrote. He was still around for the writing, throwing in melodies and the odd word etc.....telling lemmy what he wanted the songs to be about.
Without ozzy it wouldn't matter how good the songs are because they wouldn't sell.....do you think if mama was on a motorhead album it would have been on a multi platinum seller??.......there is a reason most of the money lemmy has made as a muso comes from the sales of no more tears (great songs written with his help but SUNG BY OZZY)...

The only person I hear bitching about ozzy not writing is Bob (and even he gives ozzy credit as an important part of the process).....do you hear lemmy saying "those are my bloody songs"??



Bottom line for this thread is Bobs input was HUGELY IMPORTANT....lee's not so much.....but ozzy is the reason we even know who any of them are (including randy). How many rainbow fans were saying "oh bobs working with ozzy, will have to check that album out"??

[Kel]

I've been watching this thread for ages -- my two cents


Blizzard of Ozz or the Ozzy Osbourne Band -- whatever you want to call them was one of the best rock and roll bands ever --

they all needed each other

minus bob -- little experience and musicianship
minus lee -- a solid beat
minus randy -- 'nuff said
minus Ozzy -- no recognition

they were (in my opinion) like the beatles or Zep -- that first band as it was could have been beyond great -- I know Ozz went on but without those band members and those first 2 albums I dont think he would be the "god father of heavy metal as we know him now!"

that band TOGETHER was GREAT --

just my thoughts

kel

[Cryptic Night]

The only person I hear bitching about ozzy not writing is Bob (and even he gives ozzy credit as an important part of the process).....do you hear lemmy saying "those are my bloody songs"??

Maybe that's because Ozzy claims to have written the songs that Bob wrote?

If you did a lot of work for someone, and they turned around and claimed all the glory and then sacked you and pretty much denied you ANY credit, wouldn't you be a little sour?

[rokket]

The only person I hear bitching about ozzy not writing is Bob (and even he gives ozzy credit as an important part of the process).....do you hear lemmy saying "those are my bloody songs"??

Maybe that's because Ozzy claims to have written the songs that Bob wrote?

If you did a lot of work for someone, and they turned around and claimed all the glory and then sacked you and pretty much denied you ANY credit, wouldn't you be a little sour?

I think to really understand what it's like to have someone else claim credit for your work and then to not even pay you properly, you have to have had it happen to you.

Why am I so passionate about Bob's (and to a lesser degree) Lee's situation? Because I've been ripped off too.

I spent a year researching a subject with the out come to publish a book. Through one of the contacts I had made while researching, I was contacted by a guy in the US who was "just researching my family tree". So I helped the guy fill in a few blanks he had. Then little by little, through questions and curiosity he became more and more interested. To cut a long story short, it was after he'd had access to a lot of my research, and about the 10th email from him, he tells me..."Oh, by the way, I'm a published author"..........

He released "his" book in May this year. Was even kind enough to send me a copy with a hand written note telling me how greatful he was for my "unselfish help"...........yeah right...."help" ...the book consists of 80% of my research.

Had he told me he was a published author from the beginning, or was looking to publish a book on the subject, I would never have passed on information, I would have been very cautious. But as he portrayed himself as "Joe Average next door, just simply doing some family tree research for personal use" ........I didn't see the harm.

I don't wonder what it's like to be ripped off. I know.

[estang74]

I've been watching this thread for ages -- my two cents


Blizzard of Ozz or the Ozzy Osbourne Band -- whatever you want to call them was one of the best rock and roll bands ever --

they all needed each other

minus bob -- little experience and musicianship
minus lee -- a solid beat
minus randy -- 'nuff said
minus Ozzy -- no recognition

they were (in my opinion) like the beatles or Zep -- that first band as it was could have been beyond great -- I know Ozz went on but without those band members and those first 2 albums I dont think he would be the "god father of heavy metal as we know him now!"

that band TOGETHER was GREAT --

just my thoughts

kel

ding ding ding, we have a winner. Great post my friend.

[tedeeoo]

I spent a year researching a subject with the out come to publish a book.


I really hate you had this happen to you but I have to ask, if you knew you were going to publish a book why did you share any of your research with anyone? That's really just asking for it you know.

Again, I don't think there's any question at this point about Bob and Lee's contributions and whether they deserve credit. To me the question would be, what did they sign and what are they LEGALLY entitled to, same thing I said at the start, if you sign a contract (or in some cases if you don't have a contract), you are bound to those terms however unfair and unjust they may be. Only Bob, Sharon and possibly Ozzy know what those original terms were, its really a mute point to think that the Osbournes are going to willingly share credit with anyone whether they deserve it or not, doen't mean its right its just the way it is.

Rokket I really don't mean to make light of your situation, I really do hate it happened to you and I hope you had some legal recourse to take, its hard watching someone else recieve credit for your work, believe me I've been there to. That sort of thing happens to more people than we all realize and thats why its smart to have a lawyer. Back when BOO and Diary were recorded an "entertainment" lawyer was unheard of, now, because of situations like Bob and Lee's, its the norm in the music industry.

[rokket]

I spent a year researching a subject with the out come to publish a book.


I really hate you had this happen to you but I have to ask, if you knew you were going to publish a book why did you share any of your research with anyone? That's really just asking for it you know.

Again, I don't think there's any question at this point about Bob and Lee's contributions and whether they deserve credit. To me the question would be, what did they sign and what are they LEGALLY entitled to, same thing I said at the start, if you sign a contract (or in some cases if you don't have a contract), you are bound to those terms however unfair and unjust they may be. Only Bob, Sharon and possibly Ozzy know what those original terms were, its really a mute point to think that the Osbournes are going to willingly share credit with anyone whether they deserve it or not, doen't mean its right its just the way it is.

Rokket I really don't mean to make light of your situation, I really do hate it happened to you and I hope you had some legal recourse to take, its hard watching someone else recieve credit for your work, believe me I've been there to. That sort of thing happens to more people than we all realize and thats why its smart to have a lawyer. Back when BOO and Diary were recorded an "entertainment" lawyer was unheard of, now, because of situations like Bob and Lee's, its the norm in the music industry.

well, I have learned a lesson, trust no one...!!! Had I have thought or known for a second, that the guy who ripped me off was an author or said he was doing anything other than a family tree for personal use, I wouldn't have shared a thing. I believe it's called "fishing".....seek out a bit of info here, a bit of info there, under the banner of "Oh I'm just a guy doing family tree research, yeah no big deal".......present yourself as "Joe Average" with no signs of a hidden agenda, personally, like a lot of con men, they are very, very good at what they do. I'm not the first person to be sucked in, chewed up and spat out, and won't be the last.

[Kel]

"ding ding ding, we have a winner. Great post my friend.[/quote]

thanks

[rokket]

I think everyone has vaild points from their own stand point. I mean, it all depends on how look choose to see it. I'm a huge fan of the music, but I don't call it or see it as Ozzy's, because, after all, Ozzy hasn't really written much of it, I see Ozzy as the 'voice' of the music and the one who's name it is presented/marketed and sold under, thats it IMO.

Personally, I think we'll see Bob and the Osbourne's back in a court of law one day in the near future. Not over royalties either.

I am pretty much the complete opposite....for me it is all about ozzy. Yes he is the "voice" etc but if it wasn't for ozzy being the singer I never would have bought BOO, DOAM, BATM, TUS etc etc etc....
just to go slightly of topic but if DIO singing paranoid was how sabbath sounded originally would they have been as big as they are??...I love everything the RJD did with sabbath but I struggle to listen to live evil with DIO's vocals on the ozzy songs..I rate "mob rules" in my top 10 albums ever but ronnie singing ozzy doesn't work for me. I am a fan of a few bands where the singer is just that "the singer" and doesn't write much (motley crue, skid row), but it doesn't lessen the important's of their role

I guess what I am trying to say is no matter how good/great bob (or randy for that matter) is as a writer/arranger/lyricist, it is ozzy's voice that holds the magic for me.. i love jake as much and I do randy but I couldn't give a flying F about the songs without ozzy...yes I love badlands, but not as much as BATM or TUS

I accept the fact that, for you, it's all about Ozzy, the voice etc. But what would you have thought if when you heard the first album, Blizzard Of Ozz, you heard average lyrics, and, ordinary run of the mill riffs and song structures? And if the songs were like that, would they really have made an impact on anyone? If the second album was not better or worse, would Diary Of A Madman been a great album?

A great singer and front man is not going anywhere if they are singing lame lyrics along with ordinary music, even if they did come from Black Sabbath.

For years I thought Randy and Ozzy wrote all those classic songs I love so much because Ozzy kept saying what a great writing/arranging team him and Randy were (and he still keeps saying it), Crazy Train, Over The Mountain, Mr. Crowley, Suicide Solution, to name but a few, and it's the biggest load of rubbish. The great writing/arranging team overall was Randy, Bob and Lee.

[Paul Wolfe]

Let's just say that if Bark at the Moon and The Ultimate Sin were Ozzy's solo introduction, he'd have faded years ago! He was fading anyway when those records came out... that's why he found Zakk.

Ultimately, the songs as a whole were the reason anyone paid attention to Ozzy. Regardless of what people say now, few people knew Ozzy in 1980. He was billed on the radio ads for the Blizzard tour as, "The former lead singer of Black Sabbath," so people would know who he was. There was no internet to hype stuff or MTV even. There was radio! People learned who Ozzy was when they heard Crazy Train and loved it.

Sure some folks bought the record because they saw it at the store and liked the cover and gave it a shot, but very few bought it because it was by Ozzy... in fact I'm sure a lot of Californians bought it because it was Randy!

Younger fans (born after Randy's passing) may have bought Blizzard and Diary because they are Ozzy records, but that was after he was a legend.

The Blizzard of Ozz band wrote great songs and played them well, as a result, Ozzy is a legend... He owes Bob, Lee & Randy for that and he knows it. The war continues because Bob and Lee refuse to drop it.

In my opinion. if they'd drop the money issue and let bygones be bygones, Sharon would admit they played a pivotal role and the world would get to know of their talent.

[shred1]

Excerpt from an Ozzy interview - January 1982.

“The bass player before Sarzo was a cunt. He was a fucking money-grubbing fucking tight-fisted freak.”

How long was he with you?
“About nine months.”

How’d you get him?
“He fell off a fucking Christmas tree.”

Luckily, it is all in his book. Buy it.

[Sky]

Excerpt from an Ozzy interview - January 1982.

“The bass player before Sarzo was a cunt. He was a fucking money-grubbing fucking tight-fisted freak.”

How long was he with you?
“About nine months.”

How’d you get him?
“He fell off a fucking Christmas tree.”

Luckily, it is all in his book. Buy it.

Oh you mean the Bass player Ozzy asked to come back 3 months after Sarzo joined the band? The one that he got back to do another 4 albums with him. Do you get all your info from the book that Ozzy got a literary prize for... The one he didn't write. Sound familiar? Who gives a fuck what Ozzy is supposed to have said in an interview, the Osbournes can try to obliterate them from history but nothing will ever change the fact that Bob and Lee made an invaluable contribution to BOO & DIARY and Ozzy has been reaping the profits ever since.

[shred1]

You know, I listen to RR giving bass lessons and wonder if maybe it was Randy who told Bob what to play on those tracks.
Poor Bob - used and abused. Ozzy publicly makes a comment like the one above, and Daisley STILL goes back.
Fool. Don't blame the Osbournes for those decisions.

[Sky]

You know, I listen to RR giving bass lessons and wonder if maybe it was Randy who told Bob what to play on those tracks.
Poor Bob - used and abused. Ozzy publicly makes a comment like the one above, and Daisley STILL goes back.
Fool. Don't blame the Osbournes for those decisions.

Yeah, and sometimes I think you're Sharon. You don't say where the public comments that Ozzy's supposed to have made come from, but maybe if you could see beyond the hype you'd understand why a musician with a young family to support would take paid work. Don't feel sorry for Bob, he's had an amazing career and has said so many times. I blame the Osbournes for pocketing Bob and Lee's performance royalties and for not giving credit where it's due, and that's all. It isn't about personalities it's about doing what's right.