dannyahansen wrote:If I may... I do enjoy this album but..... I would have to say there are a few issues, just some minor ones, though. I hope no one cares too much on some of the critique.
I think the thing that has bugged me the most is the audience noise. It just sounds fake or added in after words. I also hate some of the inconsistencies in terms of some of the songs, meaning that not all of the material from this album is from one show. Also, Randy seems to have missed a lost of artificial harmonics. There are a lots of examples were he did not fully hit them or missed them completely. Which to me, is a great thing because I learned that Randy was not a perfect player and he made mistakes . I used to get so frustrated at my playing because it seemed he never messed up.
One thing that I miss is the very first lick on "I Don't Know" that lick is normally more aggressive. This one just sounded like he was going through the motion. However the solo on that song is probably the best I had heard him play. I really enjoy it. And the tone on this album is awesome.
Some one mention that this show sounds like the Rhode Island boot, I 2nd that. I think that bootleg dates this show as a lot of it sounds like Rhode Island. I am not saying this show is Rhode Island just that it sounds similar.
Exactly my thoughts as well.....
However I know I am in very, very minority here....., but I don't like the guitartone that much on this new cd. It's the same sound he has on the Providence (Rhode Island) boot everybody seems to like, the overall quality is great for sure! But each time I hear the guitarsound I can't help to hear 'worn out' tubes. Even the guitarsound on Tribute (to me) sounds much better! As on most other '81 boots I heard.
That saying the whole new live cd sounds really strange to me..... also the drum sound: I do like the drumsound, t's Tommy for sure, but somehow it sounds too good (!) in combination with the rest of the band. It sounds like some modern 'addictive drums' samples. Maybe that's what they did: triggering modern 'samples' by using Tommy's original drum tracks. With nowadays technology it can be done easily..... So I really wonder what studio tricks they done to this recording? And not to forget Randy's playing itself that at times sounds really weird to me..... It already does right away with that weak intro slide at the very beginning of IDK. Is that Randy....?
So this new live cd is one big to me!
I've listened to the new live album about 15 times now. I'm familiar enough to know when all of his fills are coming up, and also I know Ozzy's stage banter by heart.
Some of these fills that Randy plays are really suspect. Seriously. It sounds like he's playing the Jackson on every single tune. It does. There is no difference in tone really from song to song.
There is a studio trick called "re-amplification." What engineers can do is isolate the guitar track, run it through a cabinet and head (or any amp rig) in a studio, slap a mic in front of it, and you can have a whole new guitar sound with the same old track. They very easily could have done this.
I love the new disc, but honestly, I'd prefer to have it sound more like the Tribute production. The current production just sounds too modern. It could (at times) be some band like Godsmack covering an old Ozzy tune. Not saying they did, but it just sounds like if someone said it, I'd have to think about it.
As far as Randy's performance, I believe it's really him -BUT, there are some licks that just don't sound like him. I really wouldn't put it past the Osbourne's to have someone like Zakk or Gus add a few things. While they DO respect Randy's legacy, I believe they'd consider anything that might make an album sound better and modern.
Guys I don't hear anything that does not sound like Randy. I can see the re-amping. I think Kevin D. did that on "QR the RR years" and I don't really have a problem with that. I have listened to RR a long time and all the fills on this disc are consistent with what I have heard in the past or with his style. Is it even possible to punch fills in that were not there without causing other problems with the rhythm guitar?
I can confirm that the following tracks do indeed include Bob and Lee on drums:
Mr. Crowley
Revelation
Steal Away the night
Suicide Solution
3 Sabbath tunes
It is very obvious to me, as per my previous post that the drums on this recording is off somehow and I knew that they weren't tommy. In fact the dead give away is the double snare accents throughout Crowley that Tommy simply never did. I imagine it was a way for the Osbournes to not credit them for the playing so they wouldn't have to pay them additional fees for this new release. Most people will not notice the difference. So it seems that most of this is the southhampton show, hence the error on the initial promo pictures with that name on the CD in the photo of the box set.
They mixed other tunes from the Tommy-Rudy line up to throw people off and to cover their tracks. I think this proves that there really isn't much else left in the vaults and they did a cut and paste job of a few shows they had access to.
I think this pretty much closes to book on this issue and soon enough we'll see some of the truth leak out.
Crowley is not Southampton. Back on the 80' tour Crowley didn't have the same concert ending Ozzy has done on every tour since. From 81 - present they do a double concert ending. In 80 they did just a single concert ending for that song. I think the spotlight solo could be Southampton. But the cd is Tommy and Rudy. They just beefed and EQ'd the drums to the sound of perfection. And to be honest I don't think they would give Bob and Lee the pleasure of using their performances.
axeman_12656 wrote:Crowley is not Southampton. Back on the 80' tour Crowley didn't have the same concert ending Ozzy has done on every tour since. From 81 - present they do a double concert ending. In 80 they did just a single concert ending for that song. I think the spotlight solo could be Southampton. But the cd is Tommy and Rudy. They just beefed and EQ'd the drums to the sound of perfection. And to be honest I don't think they would give Bob and Lee the pleasure of using their performances.
I'm not talking about the sound, I'm talking about what was actually played on drums, and that is not Tommy's playing. You can EQ something all you want, but you are still left with what was actually played, and to my ears the approach is more Lee and less Tommy on those tracks.
Although not every song on the new CD is perfect, I like RR's tone better on the new CD. Tribute is the tone that was "doctored" and re-amped (if memory serves). I do not like Tribute's guitar tone, as this new CD seems closer to RR's real tone. Tribute drowns itself in reverb, plus Ozzy's over dubbed vox (not complaining, don't want to hear the Ozz suck, but distracting nonetheless).
Believer on the new CD is painfully slow, and drags on like a Sabbath tune. Where Believer on Tribute is faster, with one of RR's best solos (IMHO).
My favorite track on the new CD is Mr Crowley (hands down). Love the different intro, all of the solos SMOKE, plus I really get off on all of the feedback/squeals at the very end. KILLER!!!!
Otherwise, this new live CD sounds simply awesome. I think it's Rudy and Tommy throughout. The sound is amazing!!! It's a mystery how OZZY sounds so good (without obvious over dubbing). Let's just be happy with a new recording to listen to for the next 25 years.....
On Tribute they added too much reverb and by redoing the vocals it seemed to also effect the mix. The cleveland original recording was more in your face as well as Montreal. To me the new cd is more like the original recordings just mastered better than the bootlegs and without the crappy reverb from tribute and lame eq. I'm not going to pick it apart, thats Randy on the new disc and it's great to have another pro performance. I would like to hear a mix like this though on Cleveland and Montreal
windingrhoads wrote:I can confirm that the following tracks do indeed include Bob and Lee on drums:
Mr. Crowley
Revelation
Steal Away the night
Suicide Solution
3 Sabbath tunes
It is very obvious to me, as per my previous post that the drums on this recording is off somehow and I knew that they weren't tommy. In fact the dead give away is the double snare accents throughout Crowley that Tommy simply never did. I imagine it was a way for the Osbournes to not credit them for the playing so they wouldn't have to pay them additional fees for this new release. Most people will not notice the difference. So it seems that most of this is the southhampton show, hence the error on the initial promo pictures with that name on the CD in the photo of the box set.
They mixed other tunes from the Tommy-Rudy line up to throw people off and to cover their tracks. I think this proves that there really isn't much else left in the vaults and they did a cut and paste job of a few shows they had access to.
I think this pretty much closes to book on this issue and soon enough we'll see some of the truth leak out.
Sorry dude, the way BOb play the bass line on MR crowley live is not what you hear on this live CD.. its Rudy..
I totally agree with you Fortress. I am a bass player (primarily) and I also play guitar, and there is absolutely no way that is Bob on bass during Crowley. The second solo totally gives it away. Rudy plays really rudimentary stuff underneath Randy's whailing solo. Bob used to really "spice it up."
I don't think any of these tracks are Bob and Lee. They are all Rudy and Tommy.
AndrewT1976 wrote:I totally agree with you Fortress. I am a bass player (primarily) and I also play guitar, and there is absolutely no way that is Bob on bass during Crowley. The second solo totally gives it away. Rudy plays really rudimentary stuff underneath Randy's whailing solo. Bob used to really "spice it up."
I don't think any of these tracks are Bob and Lee. They are all Rudy and Tommy.
You may be right about the bass playing, but I don't believe it's Tommy all the way through. I know his playing inside and out, and compared with the stuff Lee played it's closer to that.
I am 100% sure in my mind this show is from somewhere in June 81 after listening to it a bunch of times. There are just way to many references as to how his fills were progressing from early May 81 to July 81. There are a ton of fills on this live show that you can tell are the basis for fills he played from July 81 to his last shows. But, a lot of these fills were not even created in May 81 listening to the shows from that time. There are also a few small parts from solos he did that were done in all the May shows but never done from July 81 and later. But in this show its almost like a transition period where he plays just a few parts from what he played in May(progressing away from it) Ill try to get a bunch of them together this weekend to explain in more detail. On a side note there is also one fill that Rudy played on every show from July 81 and later, but not this show. Its that bass slide up the neck in the soft part of Believer in the middle of the song.
FHA is definetely from Montreal as we all know, I think the rest is from whatever show it was in June of 81, minus the Crowley intro.
to me! 
