Kathy states there will be an “exciting announcement” on Randy’s birthday..

[equinox]

Relax Andy P

You are right. Most people (even myself) see the "CRYBABY" logo on the pedal, so naturally think a Dunlop and don't have ANY idea of the history.
Same fucking pedal, but ok, to be exact, probably a Thomas Organ pre-Dunlop Cry Baby pedal!

[magicvoice]

I appreciate your passion for accuracy Andy P! Well done!

[Andy P]

Thank you Magicvoice! It's important to be accurate in all things Randy, since there are so many inaccuracies that just keep getting pushed along. Gotta keep people honest lol!
Effect pedals can vary in tone and sound depending on certain things. Wah pedals are no exception. Current wah pedals sound nothing like vintage ones, true story. Which is why I became a collector.

[equinox]

Well, thanks for the heads up. People just use Dunlop synonymously with both units as they both say "CRY BABY" on the front!

Looking at the schematics, the vintage pre-1982 units versus modern post-1982 units are quite different! Not a lot of difference between the vintage units, so don't think so much difference between California, Chicago, and Italy units.

I did a quick search locally and was able to actually find an all original California unit for sale, so picked it up for a modest $130!!

I have a modern Dunlop GCB-95 unit also, so will be making sure the vintage one is all good and check all components and once confirmed, I'll A-B it with the modern Dunlop and see if there is any significant tone differences!

I will be replacing the GCB-95 with the Thomas Organ unit on the pedalboard, where it should be!

Thanks again for the heads up and attached are the Thomas and modern Dunlop schematics for reference.

[The Flying Dutchman]

Randy did NOT use a Dunlop wah.

Dunlop was not making Cry Baby wahs at that time. The company was called Thomas Organ.
They made the Cry Baby in the 70s along with the VOX wahs.
I'm tired of seeing that incorrect information regarding Randy's wah pedal.
If you wanted a Cry Baby wah wah in the late 70s, you could either purchase a Thomas Organ 95-910511 Cry Baby or a JEN Cry Baby. The JEN was made in Italy and had a white rubber gasket / border. Very different look from the Thomas Organ wahs. I collect wahs and have both.
There is lots of information online regarding this. (There are Thomas Organ wahs w/ Cry Baby badges but w/ VOX / Cry Baby stated on the bottom plate, those are Italian Thomas Organ 95-910511 wahs. Very similar to the Thomas Organ USA models, but with taller feet and a trash can inductor.)

Randy used a Thomas Organ Cry Baby 95-910511 wah pedal.
The only questions I have are, was it made in Chicago, Ill or Sepulveda, Ca. And, did it have the TDK inductor or the Stack of Dimes inductor. Or was it the Italian 95-910511 Cry Baby / VOX stated above.

Here's a direct quote from the Dunlop website:
"In 1982, we acquired all the original tooling and machinery used by the Thomas Organ Company and Jen Elettronica when they manufactured the very first Cry Baby pedals."

There you have it.

Always thought the Crybaby was a Dunlop too, thnx for setting this straight Andy!

Question:
I tried a couple of Crybaby's but never could get that extreme 'filter' effect Randy had.
Did Randy had his Wah pedal modded for that? What do you think?

[stealaway]

I noticed that once you drop (they sometimes fall...) certain pedals, they change the sound slightly. At least this happened to my late 1970s Ibanez equalizer. Weird, huh?
On the happy note: I just aqquired Black Tokai Love Rock for quite cheap price and I'm buying a White Les Paul replica next week!!! I will start playing them soon and hopefully recording in the fall

[Andy P]

Well, thanks for the heads up. People just use Dunlop synonymously with both units as they both say "CRY BABY" on the front!

Looking at the schematics, the vintage pre-1982 units versus modern post-1982 units are quite different! Not a lot of difference between the vintage units, so don't think so much difference between California, Chicago, and Italy units.

I did a quick search locally and was able to actually find an all original California unit for sale, so picked it up for a modest $130!!

I have a modern Dunlop GCB-95 unit also, so will be making sure the vintage one is all good and check all components and once confirmed, I'll A-B it with the modern Dunlop and see if there is any significant tone differences!

I will be replacing the GCB-95 with the Thomas Organ unit on the pedalboard, where it should be!

Thanks again for the heads up and attached are the Thomas and modern Dunlop schematics for reference.

You're welcome. Nice schematics! If you want to check out more wah info, Analogman has a great article on his site with tons of info!

[Andy P]

Randy did NOT use a Dunlop wah.

Dunlop was not making Cry Baby wahs at that time. The company was called Thomas Organ.
They made the Cry Baby in the 70s along with the VOX wahs.
I'm tired of seeing that incorrect information regarding Randy's wah pedal.
If you wanted a Cry Baby wah wah in the late 70s, you could either purchase a Thomas Organ 95-910511 Cry Baby or a JEN Cry Baby. The JEN was made in Italy and had a white rubber gasket / border. Very different look from the Thomas Organ wahs. I collect wahs and have both.
There is lots of information online regarding this. (There are Thomas Organ wahs w/ Cry Baby badges but w/ VOX / Cry Baby stated on the bottom plate, those are Italian Thomas Organ 95-910511 wahs. Very similar to the Thomas Organ USA models, but with taller feet and a trash can inductor.)

Randy used a Thomas Organ Cry Baby 95-910511 wah pedal.
The only questions I have are, was it made in Chicago, Ill or Sepulveda, Ca. And, did it have the TDK inductor or the Stack of Dimes inductor. Or was it the Italian 95-910511 Cry Baby / VOX stated above.

Here's a direct quote from the Dunlop website:
"In 1982, we acquired all the original tooling and machinery used by the Thomas Organ Company and Jen Elettronica when they manufactured the very first Cry Baby pedals."

There you have it.

Always thought the Crybaby was a Dunlop too, thnx for setting this straight Andy!

Question:
I tried a couple of Crybaby's but never could get that extreme 'filter' effect Randy had.
Did Randy had his Wah pedal modded for that? What do you think?

In my experience, the older type pots have a different sweep and vocal quality than the newer pots in the stock Dunlop stuff. That being said, you can always adjust your wahs pot so you get a nice sweep more to your liking.

I don't think Randy had his wah modded at all. He rarely used it, so I don't think he would've gone that far. I believed he used it more in the spirit of Schenker, using it like you said, as a filter and a cool effect at times to add color to a part or passage.

[equinox]

I ended up pickup up an original stock 95-910511 Thomas Organ Wah locally and fairly inexpensive, so win-win!

Yes, the tapers in the past were better.

The Wah sounds fantastic also! It wil be replacing the modern Dunlop on the pedalboard!

I also was able to purchase again, an all original 1979 100w JMP, just like Randys! I used one of the 4 speaker outputs for a post Tone Stack traditional master to allow the preamp to breakup while limiting the signal to the output section, or turning it up to max! I installed the MOD Marshall did at the factory for him thanks again to Kathy and the family for the gutshot. Instead of having it hard-installed like they dad for Randy, I replaced the VOL II potentiometer from the 1M-A to a 1M-A with a push-pull switch on it, then wired it, so in, it's an unmodded JMP, but pulled, engages the mod and cascading the normal channel into the lead channel!! What the guys at Marshall did was just move ONE resistor (which Danny Thomas from Marshall confirmed when revering the amp for the tribute and someone asked if anything was out of the ordinary and he said one resistor was and you can see it in the gutshot photo)! Both MODs I made, as Randy's are reversible to turn back to stock for resale reasons if need be).

I'll have to see if there is a separate thread on the amp, but what's interesting is that the mod is done for extra gain and you'd think it would only effect the one channel as cascading them, but both channels actually increase in gain! I'll have to make some clips of that also and since I have on an on/off switch.

[equinox]

Spent some time with the amp today. Amazingly, Marshall must have ran out of 820 ohm resistors, as mine had a 1k in it, which in itself is uncommon to Marshall, but ran out and grab the next closest value. Issue is that there is about a 22% difference with this one component!! So, I corrected and still made reversible, by just adding a 4.7k resistor in parallel which makes the overall resistance 823 ohm...PERFECT!!

I spent sometime with it but NEED to make a video for everyone to see and each channel and with the potentiometer pushed in and pulled on each channel. I also added the D+ and EQ settings available and although the "Tribute" amp you plug into the CHANNEL II input, I can honestly say from hearing the amp, Randy I believe used Channel I and as others suggested and from live photos. The reason I thought not was the signal running from Normal to Bright channel, but I can report back that is not the case and with the MOD applied exactly like Randy's head. It's plugged into CHANNEL I!

Attached are photos of Randy's actual amp and circle showing the MOD with the 470k resistor moved, the layout of his actual amp I created, and his amp design, but with a traditional Post-Tonestack Master and the resistor MOD on a push-pull switch potentiometer (as mine currently is).

Enjoy!

[Andy P]

Congrats on getting the wah at such good price!
Excellent job on the amp as well! That's badass!

[Cryptic Night]

Any new word on the Distortion+ pedal release? I'm really hoping they do something more than just a cliche polkadot pedal, personally.

[equinox]

Congrats on getting the wah at such good price!
Excellent job on the amp as well! That's badass!

No sweat. Glad I have the engineering skills and know-how to contribute, as well as Jim Dunlop taking a look at that MXR pedal and see if anything different under the hood. No word yet after 5 months. Hope they don't wait until like Christmas or something. Just figure it out and what you want and release it guys. It doesn't have to be any special date. Us Rhoads fanatics just want to know and the real truth. Thanks in advance.

I'm attaching a couple updated layouts for Randy's amp and also my MODified clone with the MOD on a push-pull and post-Tone Stack Master (traditional). I've played with the amp for hours and between the Channel II and Channel I, Channel I actually sounds better as there is too much bass introduced into the amp thru the normal (bass) channel, then into the lead (bright) channel. This is what you guys were alluding to in the pic of Randy playing and communicating he plugged into Channel I-HI. Based on what I'm hearing I have to agree with that!

The MOD....DOES to something to the amp on the normal-side thinning it out and making it not so Bass heavy and seems to add gain to it! I'll have to post on that and what it is doing. It's really amazing to get "the" tone, you can just have an amp and speaker cab, it really is sum of the wholes! It's taking the amp with modest gain, bass heavy, running it thru the MXR for more gain and saturation, then thru the EQ to voice it and get rid of bad characteristics while increasing ones that are advantageous. Then at that point you have good tone, but not done yet!....then you throw it thru the Altec, which are COMPLETELY different than Celestions and don't add any further dirt to it as high wattage clean speakers, but with the aluminum cone cover gives the glassiness, ghosting and more high end to cut thru a mix before you get the OVERALL tone and you HAVE To have ALL of the items to get there, else you're 50%, 80% there!!

I already blueprinted the 1979 amp and did the layout and took all voltages. The voltages are similar with what the Tribute amp had and 460V on the plates of the original and about 310-315V on the Phase Inverter for both.

Next Steps: I will convert the Tribute clone amp I built to Randy's original MODded amp (built up the bare PCB last night) and A-B to ensure no difference, then I should be done with this exercise!

[Andy P]

Excellent work. Love all the details! Interesting description of the Altecs as well. Would love to try those out and compare like you are doing.

[equinox]

You're welcome as well as everyone.
I'm a perfectionist, if you cannot tell! lol
Always busy, so never have the time to do clips of...the pedalboard, A-B amps....hopefully I will soon, but don't hold you're breath, but hope to get something out there for people to see.